C.o.R.E. Spotlight - AMA with Immutable X

The C.o.R.E. Spotlight AMA series highlights our upcoming C.o.R.E.3 candidates, giving Pilots an inside look at why they are interested in a Tokemak Reactor.

C.o.R.E. Spotlight - AMA with Immutable X

With C.o.R.E.3 beginning next week, the Tokemak team has lined up a series of AMAs ("Ask Me Anything") with various Reactor candidates.

The Spotlight Series will allow the Tokemak community to familiarize itself with the protocols that are interested in securing a Reactor of their own, and get a peek into why these DAOs are so interested in moving away from liquidity mining in favor of sustainable liquidity.

Next up is Immutable X, a highly scalable and carbon-neutral Layer 2 designed for NFTs. The chain features zero-gas trades and minting while offering the same security as Ethereum mainnet.

Immutable X is a next-generation protocol for trading Ethereum NFTs. It gives users instant trade confirmation, massive scalability, and no gas fees — without compromising user custody.

Immutable and StarkWare partnered to create Immutable X, combining StarkWare's world-class layer-2 scaling knowledge with Immutable's deep understanding of the NFT space.

For more information about Immutable:


C.o.R.E. Spotlight Schedule


Alternatively, the recording is available on SoundCloud.

"We want to bring NFT liquidity to the entire world." - Nigel Lee

Key Takeaways

  • Nigel Lee has been with ImmutableX for one year. Primary role is community-oriented, but was previously involved in product and the token launch.
  • Nico has been with with Immutable for a few months. Primary role is operations and strategy, but is a jack of all trades.
  • The team's core thesis is the belief that the current state of NFT trading is broken due to order fragmentation across marketplaces. Immutable wants to bring NFT liquidity to the world.
  • Immutable X is an Ethereum layer 2 protocol based on StarkNet that offers zero-gas transactions.
  • The Immutable X global orderbook allows NFTs to be available across all marketplaces that have integrated with the protocol.
  • Existing projects can migrate to Immutable X, but new projects that launch directly on the protocol benefit from zero-gas mints.
  • The Bored Ape Yacht Club Otherside NFT launch would have been a perfect use case for Immutable X, since the protocol offers far better scalability and zero-gas mint. Users would have saved millions in gas fees.
  • The IMX token was launched in order to incentivize usage of the platform, supercharge the flywheel, and share the value with the community. It has also given the project the war chest needed to further build out the platform.
  • IMX currently has a liquidity mining program on SushiSwap, and has also considered using Olympus Pro.
"At the end of the day, I think liquidity is really important, whether that's sourced natively or otherwise...and I think as a measure for us to improve our liquidity, I think Tokemak offers a fantastic product and service in the space and is part of the whole DeFi 2.0 innovations." – Nico
  • Immutable X's long-term goal is to be the de facto underlying NFT base layer, and onboard users to games that utilize NFTs and settle on layer 1 Ethereum seamlessly.
"We believe a lot of the utility of NFT trading will come from gaming, and we want to own that space. There's a lot of room to grow. Gaming is a $300 billion market or something like that. And I think NFTs are only at $10 billion. It's scratching the surface. And as web3 and gaming grows to the full potential, we expect the market share of blockchain gaming to expand exponentially. And we want to be the leader in that space. And I think that is super exciting. And after gaming, it's just everything else that NFT will touch. We want to be the leader of that." – Nigel

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Rough Transcript of AMA

[00:00:00.190] - CJ
You know, I think we can get started. Our good friend tratium here seems to be everywhere, which we appreciate, and he'll be recording and distributing for us. So shout out to tratium, being a helpful OG for us, getting the word out about what we're up to, and helping to spread these conversations. So thank you. But yeah, I'll go ahead and kick things off.

Nigel, Nico, welcome. We are continuing our CoRE Spotlight series where we are having AMAs with protocols and DAOs interested in trying to win a Tokemak Reactor as part of our third CoRE event. And so we are introducing various protocols with our community, discussing what they do and possible synergies together. Just an opportunity to learn more about the types of people that we could work with in the future. So, Nigel, Nico, welcome. Glad to have you here today.

[00:00:54.830] - Nigel
Hello. Thanks for having me.

[00:00:56.590] - Nico
Thanks for having me.

[00:00:57.120] - Nigel
Looking forward to chatting with you.

[00:00:59.270] - CJ
I'm also looking forward to it. One more piece of housekeeping: if anyone in the audience has questions during the AMA, go ahead and drop them in the CoRE3 channel on the left. And that goes for Nigel and Nico. If there's any collateral or information you'd like to share with our pilots in the community, that CoRE3 channel is also going to be the place to drop them. So hoping to hear some questions and we'll get them answered here towards the end of the conversation. So, gentlemen, to kick things off, could you give us some background both on yourselves and introduce what Immutable X does to the community?

[00:01:36.890] - Nigel
Cool. Let me introduce myself. I can do the introduction of Immutable X as well, but later on after Nico introduces himself.

Hello, everybody. My name is Nigel. I've been with Immutable for about a year now. My current role is to work on community specifically, but I've been through a number of roles in Immutable, as you do in a startup. For example, I was very involved in building launching the token last year. I was working on product stuff as well for a few months and worked on support and community, so I've been around the entire company. My past background was in SaaS and then before that I was in management consulting. So yeah, that's a quick TLDR on me. Passing the mic to Nico.

[00:02:29.510] - Nico
Thank you, Nigel. I've been around for a few months – backing up the success Nigel had in the role for me, part of the token team, doing a lot of ops, strategy, getting people processor systems up to date. A bit of a jack of all trades, if you will. My background before this is quite diverse. Did property development, did some management consulting, did some investment banking. Honestly, I have a really short attention span and I think that suits me well to crypto, which is why I'm here.

[00:03:03.530] - CJ
There's a lot to keep up with. So yeah, hopefully you can pay attention to all the protocols launching on a daily basis. Well, awesome. Thanks for the background on both your career histories. Can you introduce Immutable X to the community? What do you guys do?

[00:03:18.830] - Nigel
Yeah, definitely. So I'm sending some collateral in the chat right now, just like a quick link and some two pictures to help with the discussion. But basically, our thesis is: the way you trade NFTs right now is broken. Simple as that.

And why is it broken? What we label it as is order fragmentation. And what does that exactly mean? So imagine you as a seller. If you're trying to sell an NFT, you need to list that in multiple marketplaces right now, especially in layer 1. And if you're a marketplace, when you're trying to sell stuff from your marketplace, you're limited to your storefront or the number of people who actually visit your website. And we think that's like a very old way of thinking about trading, especially NFTs, which is inherently quite not liquid. And we want to bring NFT liquidity to the world into the entire market. And we think there's a better way to trade NFTs. And that's where the Immutable X global order book comes in. And there's a key feature of the Immutable X protocol. So if you take a look at the CoRE3 channel, I posted two pictures there.

[00:04:29.390] - Nigel
The picture at the bottom is basically how marketplaces work right now, especially when you're trying to trade an NFT. You have the blockchain. Each marketplace has their own order book, and each has their own exchange contract, et cetera. So...it's actually very difficult to move your trades or NFTs from one marketplace to another.

What we're trying to do is basically just to aggregate all of that into one core order block so that anybody – a seller, a buyer, or a marketplace – can just have access to that and can very easily sell and trade their entities wherever they want. So that's composability to the extreme, or interoperability to the extreme. That's the simple TLDR of the global order book.

I can share more if you have any questions on that, but there's a number of other benefits that we offer to that as well. For example, we do this in a layer 2. So we're a zk rollup. As a zk rollup, we're super secure. I can get more into that later, as well as a layer 2 where gas-free, you can literally trade 100 times without paying gas. So that's a huge benefit compared to layer 1.

[00:05:40.970] - Nigel
Third is that we are carbon neutral. So because we're rolling things up and we're aggregating things, we spend a lot less gas and we're offsetting, I think, 99% of the normal gas transaction, and therefore the carbon emissions, by using our layer 2. And we have a strong network of brands. I don't know if you've heard of us; you've worked with TikTok, GameStop, et cetera, and obviously we have a token.

So that's like a quick TL;DR. Happy to deep dive into specific things that people might have questions about contact.

[00:06:13.730] - CJ
Yeah. I would love to dig in on a few items there. Are you primarily a place to go to trade existing NFTs, or are you also in a position to help new projects or current projects mint NFTs for the first time?

[00:06:29.870] - Nigel
Any of those is totally okay with the IMX protocol. You can move your NFTs into layer 2 with us, or...what our preference is actually...is for new projects to just mint their NFTs on layer two because they can mint for free. They don't have to pay for that transaction, and their customers don't have to pay for that maintenance transaction as well.

So a good use case for us, for example, is Gods Unchained, which is one of the teams that Immutable has built. And it's also on Immutable X. It's a trading card game...like Magic the Gathering. So if you can imagine, a trading card game usually has thousands, if not millions of cards. Minting that and trading that daily would be impossible in layer 1, and that's just a normal day for us.

[00:07:17.270] - CJ
So let me bring up an example that I'd love your feedback on. In the past few days, I believe the apes from Yuga Labs did a mint. I'm curious if you could weigh in on sort of introduce what that looked like from your side just as a quick example...and what it would have looked like had they been using a solution like Immutable X for that mint.

[00:07:41.150] - Nigel
Yeah, definitely. So obviously everybody knew what happened in the gas wars. That came to be because of the super-popular land sale during the weekend. I believe our founder Robbie even reached out and said: hey, we're reaching out to Yuga Labs to see if they came to collaborate, because if they did it in a layer 2...let's remove the bias from Immutable X already. Right. If they did it in a layer 2, then nobody would have had to pay gas. The transactions would have taken seconds rather than having a long wait time. There's no reason why you couldn't have just used a layer 2 and use a layer 1 instead.

[00:08:26.810] - CJ
I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I believe tens if not over $100 million was wasted in gas fees on that. Yeah, that's a lot of money that goes to the Ethereum miners, but not necessarily people trying to acquire these NFTs.

[00:08:45.210] - Nigel
Yeah, exactly. So there's a lot of inefficiencies there. So the gas fees, the carbon emissions, the wait time, just the effort of people. Right. If you wanted to open up this ecosystem to normal people, then that would have been very difficult. Just because of the gas fees, the normal people who wanted to get into the ape ecosystem would have been priced out effectively. So if you remove those gas fees, that's at least one barrier less to get more people into the ecosystem. So I think that's...what we're trying to get to. Getting into the mainstream makes sense.

[00:09:22.400] - CJ
So I'm on your website, which is Immutable.com, and I'm reading that you are the first layer 2 for NFTs on Ethereum. So you're helping Ethereum scale. But I'm curious if you can talk about why an L2 solution would need its own native token.

[00:09:40.330] - Nigel
Why an L2 solution would need its own native token? Right. So the token, I'm sure Nico, who is on the token team, will have a better view of this in particular. But for us, the token is really there to...number one: supercharge the ecosystem, and number two: share that value with everybody who believes in the ecosystem.

So at the end of the day, we believe that we want...our entire mission...so I guess this actually deserves a little bit of a backstory. Our founders built Immutable X and a blockchain game, mainly because they felt the pain of playing a game and not having ownership of their items and then just getting burned when things didn't go well with that game. We are a true believer of ownership and giving power to the people who are actually adding value to the ecosystem. And that's the main driver of giving these tokens, or creating these tokens and sharing it with the world...is to be able to give access to people, to have ownership with all the things that we do. But from a more commercial ecosystem center point of view, the tokens are there to really supercharge the flywheel, as we call it, so that we can incentivize the right behavior within our ecosystem.

[00:10:59.140] - Nigel
So if you think about a marketplace, you want to have more buyers and sellers or content creators. If you want to incentivize more people to create on our platform, toolkits are a good way to do that and supercharge the flywheel. But at the same time, if you want more traders or more people to actually do important stuff in the platform, like trading, speaking, et cetera, then tokens are also a great way to incentivize that...which I think is very important to, again, supercharge a flywheel, make sure growth is up into the left and a half. But yeah, Nico will probably know a little bit more about this.

[00:11:36.850] - Nico
I think that's exactly right. It comes down to ownership and incentives, and the development of a token gives Immutable – the protocol Immutable X – a very big war chest that we can use to grow the ecosystem and develop network effects.

A marketplace is only as good as the number of projects that are listed and the number of users that come to trade on it. And one of the earlier questions you asked was: can...existing NFT collections come on? Absolutely. And that's something that's in the works in the background.

Why does it need a native token, and what are the benefits of the token as per white paper and what do I mean by that? There are governance elements, there are staking benefits, and it really comes down to that shared ownership.

[00:12:32.590] - Nigel
Yeah. And speaking of the white paper: if you see the allocation, half of that is for ecosystem development, which again goes back to the point of tokens there to grow the ecosystem, if anything else...if nothing else.

[00:12:47.680] - CJ
Great. Thanks for weighing in on that topic. So given you have a token which is IMX...I see it listed on SushiSwap and a number of centralized exchanges. Can you talk about how you approached liquidity for the token – either when it first launched or, now that it's been on the market for not quite a year, but a decent amount of time? Curious if you can weigh on the thought process behind depth or any challenges with liquidity...if you can opine on that subject for a minute.

[00:13:20.950] - end0xiii
One piggyback question on that, actually, just before we lead into that, is: just following up with what you said about the token in general. So IMX is on mainnet as well. Is the main incentive to have IMX both on mainnet and the Immutable X L2, just to be thought of as sort of like a liquid portal or access point bridging between the two chains? Or what was the main drive to have the token on mainnet as well?

[00:13:57.880] - Nico
It's a good one. And the short answer is that there's no swapping functionality at the moment on the protocol, and that is on the roadmap. And that is why in order to get the token out, distribution first, it was launched on mainnet.

[00:14:15.810] - end0xiii
A lot of the functionality of the token staking, et cetera – that does occur on the L2.

[00:14:23.330] - Nico
Correct.

[00:14:24.390] - end0xiii
Got it.

[00:14:25.400]
Okay.

[00:14:28.110] - Nico
Going back to...the question about how did we initially think of liquidity? I think Nigel, who drove a lot of the work on the exchange listings in a very short time period, has done a fantastic job.

The initial focus was distribution and then secondary was looking at liquidity, and some of the concepts we'd initially thought of were...liquidity mining, which was very prevalent at the time. Olympus, which had been a pioneer in protocol and liquidity protocol controlled value, had been growing as a community and had raised a few of our eyebrows internally. And it's something that we have within our internal roadmap, something would like to move towards.

However, in the current environment, as you've identified, we currently have a liquidity mining program on Sushi, and that's in order to develop a very liquid market in that token. As you know, deep liquidity is important to offer low slippage for holders that wish to accumulate large positions and just ease of transactions, especially in volatile times. And the way we think of our liquidity is as a general health metric of our protocol. It's a measure of ease of transactions. On the one hand, you've got the centralized exchanges which offer deep markets for centralized transactions, and then you've also got another market segment.

[00:15:50.230] - Nico
We prefer to operate on the decentralized exchange route, which is my preference also. So that's how we initially thought of our token liquidity. That view is evolving, however, in terms of our roadmap. Probably not a priority for the time being, and we're satisfied with that. And I think it's probably where this conversation has popped up and how can we source other avenues of liquidity through Tokemak? And I think this is an important discussion that we're having now. The other angle of thinking of liquidity is also down the NFT route, which I think Nigel commented on a lot, and that's really our vision: to enhance NFT liquidity and reduce the fragmentation of NFT marketplaces. Does that answer your question?

[00:16:46.470] - CJ
It does, yeah. It's always interesting to hear different perspectives on liquidity. Some of the more...retail users of our platform would approach our solution differently than like a DAO or a protocol needing liquidity for their token. So it's always interesting to hear either challenges or perspectives when launching a token or trying to increase liquidity across the number of venues. It's always interesting to hear those stories and those challenges associated with what it takes to stand up a token and ensure it's healthy over the course of its existence as well. So that was kind of leading up to my next one, which is: why you guys were interested in participating in CoRE, and why you would potentially be interested in winning a Reactor if you are successful in placing in the top five in our current events.

[00:17:36.850] - Nico
At the end of the day, I think liquidity is really important, whether that's sourced natively or otherwise...and I think as a measure for us to improve our liquidity, I think Tokemak offers a fantastic product and service in the space, and is part of the whole DeFi 2.0 innovations.

I think the other benefit of participating in this is getting our brand out there, and whether that is to new users to IMX, to new NFT traders looking to participate, or new potential gamers looking to interact with our other tokens or games...whether it be Gods Unchained or Guild of Guardians, it's an opportunity to improve our broader market awareness, which I think is probably not an area that we've focused on as much in the past, and we're looking to continue growing that footprint.

[00:18:30.370] - Nigel
And what I'd add to that is if you think of this from a community's perspective, who I work with day to day...they're really looking for other ways to use their IMX holdings because, for example, what we have right now with SushiSwap...I've heard a few members of these being, as you know, afraid of impermanent loss...which to me is quite interesting with Tokemak Reactors being able to abstract that away from potential liquidity providers...which I think is an interesting opportunity and alternative to our current token holders. So I'm keen to see how they react after something like this as well.

[00:19:08.590] - CJ
Absolutely awesome. Thanks. Yeah. My next question has to do with what synergies or collaborations you envision with Tokemak. From my side, we are a solution that anyone in DeFi with a token can use, and you would be our first L2 on the platform as a Reactor, which would be super interesting for us. So we're always interested in diversifying our use cases and seeing who we can help. But yeah, I'm curious if there were any ideas off the top of your head for other types of collaboration with Tokemak beyond just a Reactor for your governance token.

[00:19:51.050] - Nico
As an NFT marketplace, the focus of what Immutable X is really doing is trying to develop and bring gaming to NFTs and bring digital ownership to the world. In effect, I think there are opportunities for Immutable X to also bring in subsequent application tokens from some of our development partners. I think what you've got and ourselves as the first L2 is only the start.

As you know, L2s are a bit of a growing narrative at the moment across Twitter and the blockchain ecosystem. I think there are lots more opportunities to see these projects grow and develop, and in due course develop their own tokens that will also benefit from liquidity from the benefits to Tokemak. That's clear to me; however, it's always a bit opaque.

The other element from our side, obviously, is...bringing in liquidity to our token is super helpful. Being able to offer single sided staking to our community without the risk of impermanent loss is super helpful. Directing it to Sushi and benefiting from the Sushi emissions and IMX emissions is also super helpful for Tokemak's intent to grow protocol controlled value.

[00:21:21.630] - Nigel
Yeah, and padding on to that idea...Sorry, Nico, were you just going to say something? Should I?

[00:21:26.960] - Nico
No, I was literally going to say that Nigel has got some more thoughts for sure.

[00:21:31.590] - Nigel
Yeah. So pardon me if this is a crazy idea, but I'm usually full of crazy ideas. But when you were asking that question, a crazy idea that got into my head was like: what if there were Reactors as a service? Right.

Immutable X, as Nico mentioned, we're onboarding games left and right. We want to be the place gamers trade NFTs, and there's like a ton of NFT gaming companies that are just launching. And all of them will probably want to be in web3. They will probably all, at least at some point, want to have their own tokens. And all of those will probably have some sort of liquidity question or problem come up when they're trying to launch your token. And everybody's going to be in there too as well.

So how can we make token liquidity as a service super available and easy to access for any other game app that launches on layer 2? And what I think is exciting about that is layer 2 is designed to be mainstream. It's designed to be catering to the next billion users out there. And how do we scale together both tokens and token liquidity for all of these companies and apps that are going to be launching two or three years from now?

[00:22:51.310] - Nigel
And I think that's exciting. That's just...a ton of opportunity there that's still untapped.

[00:22:56.370] - CJ
Totally. That is super exciting. And that's where we want to move to. So in our initial launch, we're doing these CoRE events, and that's our process: to have the community weigh in and vote for the projects we're adding during our initial rollout phase. But our future is certainly one where we have permissionless Reactors, where any protocol, any game file, any NFT project with their own governance token would be able to show up on our platform and be able to set one up, so that they'd be in control of establishing deep liquidity for their own native tokens.

So absolutely more than happy to partner with you and make our services available to your growing community. I think that would be a tremendous route for collateralization here in the future, because ultimately we want to be a layer that sits on top of DeFi, and we want to be cross-chain. We want to work with any protocol no matter what they're doing, as long as they have a governance token and have a need for liquidity. So super interesting idea that matches really nicely with our roadmap and what we want to accomplish. We have more to talk about there for sure.

[00:24:03.130] - Nigel
Awesome.

[00:24:03.630] - CJ
Gentlemen, what would the most successful version of Immutable X look like? I'm curious. If everything goes right – bull market, you crush development, you hire all the right people, you accomplish your goals. What does that look like for you? And I'm curious what it would take for you to get there.

[00:24:25.450] - Nigel
Yeah, definitely. Nico, feel free to chime in. But in my view, it's really owning gaming. First and foremost, we believe a lot of the utility of NFT trading will come from gaming, and we want to own that space. There's...a lot of room to grow. Gaming is a $300 billion market or something like that. And I think NFTs are only at $10 billion. It's scratching the surface. And as web3 and gaming grow to their full potential, we expect the market share of blockchain gaming to expand exponentially. And we want to be the leader in that space. And I think that is super exciting. And after gaming, it's just everything else that NFT will touch. We want to be the leader of that.

[00:25:13.730] - Nico
Sorry for cutting in.

[00:25:15.710] - Nigel
No, go ahead. I was just going to say: feel free to chime in as well.

[00:25:19.530] - Nico
Yeah, I was going to add that...to me, what does the future look like? What does success look like? To me, it's a world where people are using Immutable X without realizing they're using Immutable X. That may take the form of playing a game, conducting in game transaction that may or may not use NFTs.

And the vision that we're building towards is likely to use NFTs that the players need not know they are transacting. NFTs on a blockchain that is settled to layer 1 on Ethereum. And this is really exciting, because I think most of us would agree A) we are early and B) it's not user-friendly generally for mass adoption. I think there's many steps we need to get there.

Success for us is being able to onboard millions and millions of people that use blockchain and use NFTs but don't realize they're using it. And in doing so, we are able to bring in not just the gaming elements, but also every other vertical and every other industry. But this is the vision/mission, and this is the big hairy audacious goal.

[00:26:31.190] - CJ
Well, I certainly hope you get there, and I hope we're able to assist in that journey as well. Any items on your roadmap in the next couple of months that our audience should look out for? Anything fun, anything exciting, anything you could...not necessarily leak, but perhaps anything publicly available that you guys would want to share with our community for what's coming up here in the near future?

[00:26:54.350] - Nigel
Yeah, for sure. There's like a few things that...it's not really a secret, but it's upcoming and some of the biggest things that we are excited about. We have a big push right now of integrating with as many top marketplaces as possible. So for example, we announced, OKX, NFT Trade...GameStop is upcoming. We have so many more marketplaces that we're excited to announce that it's like in the middle of being integrated and partnered with, and that's coming in like a few months. I'm super excited for that to happen.

And also the games...there's been a few games that's been under construction for a while now. I don't know if you've heard of them. For example: Illuvium and Emperor Sword. We're working closely with these partners and we're trying to push for just a smooth transition and integration overall. And when it finally launches...I don't have the dates right in front of you, but when it finally launches, I think it's going to be a really great proof point to the world that blockchain gaming is here and it's going to be a lot of fun.

[00:28:01.190] - CJ
Can't wait. I'm definitely looking forward to that one. Any questions for you guys?

[00:28:06.300] - end0xiii
Yeah, an L2 question from a non-techie but interested perspective. I think right now when we think about layer 2, we think mostly about Optimism and Arbitrum. But you guys are utilizing StarkNet, and I know StarkNet isn't quite live yet, but obviously there's some working infrastructure that you're utilizing. Can you talk a little bit about your decision to go with StarkNet and what advantages it had over maybe other L2 for this specific use case?

[00:28:41.690] - Nigel
Got it. I will try. I'm obviously not technical as well. Nico, I'm not sure if you are across this question, but from my understanding and my own research when I was joining the company as well StarkWare in their stark proofs...there's a fundamental difference between what Optimism does, for example...that they use is a fraud proof, if I remember correctly. And then ours is something like a validity proof. And in my opinion, from a nontechnical point of view, the key benefit of that is when somebody wants to withdraw money from our platform, they can do it within a day. Like it's...automatically. Whereas in Optimism there is a seven-day period between trying to withdraw your money and actually getting it right.

So that's not necessarily bad, but it is inconvenient waiting seven days for your money. And I'm a strong believer that if somebody wants to have their money, you should just give it to them. Right? There shouldn't be this long, inconvenient waiting period when you do that transaction or withdrawal, which I think is generally from, again, a nontechnical point of view...a strong benefit, obviously. I'm sure there are a lot more technical benefits there, like...I don't know, security or the difference between stark proofs and what Optimism uses, but I'm sure an engineer would be able to answer that better than me.

[00:30:05.520] - Nigel
I'm not sure if you have a little bit more background on this.

[00:30:08.850] - Nico
No, I think that was well answered. It really comes down to the way they settle back down and the speed of transfer. I mean, you can always pay a fee to sign-ups if you want to transfer immediately, not from Optimism or Arbitrum, but that's an additional friction that the user shouldn't be responsible for. But it comes down to each user's decision at the end of the day, and we wanted to offer something which was faster and in our mind, better for our users.

[00:30:40.170] - Nigel
Sweet.

[00:30:41.170] - end0xiii
Thanks, guys.

[00:30:43.110] - Nigel
Awesome. Thanks for having us today. Happy to answer any more questions. I'll hang around in the course of the chat. I'll probably reply slowly, but I'll try to answer any other questions that audience has.

[00:30:55.470] - CJ
Yeah, this has been great. The one thing I was going to ask is: if someone wants to keep track of your progress, where should they go to follow Immutable X?

[00:31:04.950] - Nigel
Yeah, definitely. Please do follow our Twitter account and our Discord. Join our Discord right now...and we have announcements and events reminders every week. And Twitter, obviously that's where everything is happening. Please follow us as well. I'll drop some links in the CoRE3 chat.

[00:31:22.470] - CJ
Perfect. That sounds like a plan. Well, Nigel, Nico, thank you both so much for joining us today. It's been a great conversation. I really appreciate it.

[00:31:30.810] - Nigel
Thank you. Thanks for the invite. Yeah.

[00:31:33.850] - end0xiii
Thanks so much, guys. For coming in.

[00:31:35.350] - Nigel
Appreciate it.

[00:31:36.810] - CJ
Alright. Take care. All. Thanks.

[00:31:39.090] - Nigel
Thank you.

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